“So-So” is NO-NO
China is a developing country and will remain a developing country so long as the national standard (excuse) for poor services and poor products is “This is China, so-so is ok.”
From sales clerks in department stores, to policemen on the street, to medical staff in the best hospitals, service is extremely poor, the result of apathy, indifference, and incompetence. Nobody seems to care.
Goods and products are substandard and even defective but no one complains. Chinese people have learned that complaining brings you personal trouble.
Most Chinese do not want to excel or stand out. They would rather be lost in a crowd than recognized for excellence. Criticism is expected but compliments are taboo and considered embarrassing.
“FACE” is the most prized possession. Chinese do not realize that FACE is simply false pride and has no real time value or that it in fact inhibits personal growth and development. It is not good to lose FACE (be embarrassed) or to cause someone else to lose FACE. Take FACE to Starbucks and see what it will buy. NOTHING!
Take FACE to class and refuse to participate for fear of making mistakes and losing FACE. There will be no educational progress.
Conclusion
This article has developed the argument that the influence of face in classroom interactions is pervasive, complex and powerful among Chinese, illustrated here in a UK university. The concept of face enables us to account for much Chinese behavior in the classroom setting. The four types of face-related factors: low-risk face, collective face, hierarchical face and harmonious face, which are clearly demonstrated in the three Chinese participants in this study, revealed their effectiveness in preventing the active participation of the three Chinese in the classroom activities regardless of their linguistic abilities. The dynamics of the concern for face revealed in this study has confirmed the findings of Chang and Holt (1994), Gao (1996) and Hwang (1987) concerning the face issue among Chinese in settings other than the
classroom. To cite this Article Wu, Xiaoxin(2009) ‘The dynamics of Chinese face mechanisms and classroom behavior: a case study’, Evaluation & Research in Education, 22: 2, 87 — 105
The above article is available to SYSU students on Professor Wolff’s university page.
http://engedu.sysu.org.cn/graduate/holistics/index2.html
The “collective face” retards China’s development. “So-So” is non-confrontational and allows everyone to maintain FACE. But it also insures that services and goods remain at the poorest common denominator, poor.
FACE is a direct consequence of the socialist society that criticizes and even punishes anyone who achieves, excels or stands out, but rewards those who blend in or melt into the crowd. So-So becomes the social standard, although it is a standard of mediocrity.
China’s educational system is a direct product of this collective face mentality. It fuels the test taking mentality and the chalk and talk pedagogy. Every student is required to memorize the exact same answer to each and every question. No one is allowed to think or act differently. Everyone is a robot with programmed thoughts and memorized answers and no one loses FACE. For all to succeed and not lose FACE, the regimen must be at the lowest common denominator.
A BEAUTIFUL MIND IS A TERRIBLE THING TO WASTE!
So long as FACE is a prized possession, China will remain a developing country. FACE predestines failure, it does not foster success.
JUST SAY “NO-NO” TO “SO-SO.”
I agree that “Collective Face” do have some negative effects on developing students’ thinking ability. But another more critical reason is the Chinese way of learning things which is very different from western way. Chinese way seems to emphasis on fostering intellect than intellingence. We focus on making students knowlegeable rather than capable.
And then you can tell apparently Chinese students learn things by being told without thinking it through. It is a very efficient way of teaching when you have so many students but not a good way.
I can’t agree with the idea proposed by Lisa Class 10C more. FACE is indeed not a simple problem. It could mirror the Chinese history of courtesy and polite. However, we also have to know that courtesy and polite should be distinguished from FACE. FACE not only makes you feel unnatural, but discourages you against expressing yourself. So FACE is not good in the process of learning language.
“Face” is indeed the special culture in China, and it has influenced the behavior of most Chinese. We have to admit that it has brought a lot of problems to China, but as it has such a long history that we cannot overcome it in a minute. In my opinion, what we Chinese should do nowadays is to realize the negative effects of it, and revise our thoughts and behavior gradually. And I also believe that as China is becoming more and more open, it will absorb the western patterns of behavior which are good for its development, since “tolerance” has always been the glorious tradition of our Chinese people. We have the confidence that China’s future is very bright and will grow into one of the most developed countries in the world.
The author found some problems of our country ,but it wasn’t completely so.For example,”From sales clerks in department stores, to policemen on the street—, service is extremely poor, the result of apathy, indifference, and incompetence. Nobody seems to care.” Our country is developing,this is truth.But our government and people from all ways are improving the situation as possible as they could,so it’s not that all goods and products are substandard ,even defective and no one care it.Moreover,in fact many Chinese have realized that FACE is simply false pride and has no real time value or that it inhibits personal growth and development. Only they hardly slove it perfectly.I think I do a lot of thing according to “face”.But I believe I can forget it slowly.
What the article talked about makes me think of lots of things. Here are my opinions.
Firstly, though we know it is not right, lots of Chinese people hold the attitude that “so –so is OK”, even we students. Some of us dare to be more excellent that other ones.
Secondly, the “so-so ”attitude is affected by the Confucianism which has a long history in China. It is one important part of the traditional China culture and difficult to get rid of.
What is more, We should try our best to change the thinking way of becoming a “so-so” person. Only in this way ,can we get great improvement and live a better life. If all the Chinese pursuit to be “so-so”, it is nearly impossible for China to get further development.
At last,Though face is important ,we should not too care about it. We should encourage ourselves to do the things that interested us. Even we maybe fail, it is worth for us to have a try.
When talks about “face”, different people have different about that, in my opinion, I think we can’t one-sidedly to say love our “face” is good or not, we should treat dialectically about this.
As we all know, our Chinese people pay more attention to our “face”, even we doesn’t want to face my weak. As this article says, “face” not only brings many obstacles in our study and daily life but also prevent us from achieving success. So, we should to correct our thought and the way to consider and solve problems, and face our weak points directly; otherwise we can’t improve and stand in front of world.
But other hand, we can’t say “face” is not a bad thing completely. If you don’t want to a good “face”, others will not to respect you, you can’t get many things too.
In china, FACE is very important. At first, FACE means fame. To keep one’s FACE, one should be honest, kind and work hard. That is to say, one should be a good man. But as time goes by, the meaning of FACE is totally changed.
If a person wants to keep his FACE, he should be very careful and try his best not to make a mistake. Because once he makes a big mistake, this may be talked about by others year after year. This kind of feeling is horrible.
Especially to an adult, losing FACE means losing respect from others and also effect on one’s social rank. FACE makes people be afraid of expressing themselves. They do not want to make mistake, so they just follow the main stream of society.
So I think to learn English well, we should use it. And we cannot avoid making some mistakes, which means we must forget our FACE.
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As many sinologists noticed, although a universal human nature and a ubiquitous concept that occurs in all culture, face is particularly salient for Chinese culture. Even some scholars believe that the concept of face is in fact Chinese in origin. In Short Oxford Dictionary on Historical Princeples , “to lose face” is rendered directly from the Chinese phrase “diu lian”: English explanation is “ to lose one’s credit, good name or reputation”.
“Face” is evident in all aspects of Chinese life. The Chinese often avoid the word “No” to save face for both parties. Words such as “bu fangbian” (inconvenient) , “tai kunnan” (too difficult) or “huoxu” (maybe) are aften synonyms of “No” in Chinese culture. The Chinese “Yes” (shi) can also be elusive – a word that has little meaning because it is used t repond to almost everything, such as “Yes, but it is inconvenient” – it actually means “No”.
Face is also evident in a Chinese business negotiation context. Many observers find that the Chinese prefer to do business with large companies with world reputations to gain face. Even in business negotiations, we can use the face to explain the Chinese negotiation style – for example, meeting in a group, proceeding cautiously and slowly – from the face perspective.
BUT the famous American company, in which I worked as a vendor manager before, also prefers to do business with large companies, and that can be seen from their vendor evaluation criteria such as total sales, total stuff and so on. What’s more, I worked with vendors from some other Asia countries, take Japan as an example. They would like to do everything cautiously and slowly.
So I think FACE is not only part of Chinese culture but also part of culture of human being.
Can FACE represent the Chinese core cultural spirit and mirror a phenomenon that most Chinese hold a “muddle through” view of life? My answer is NO. Nevertheless, in my view the speaker unfairly generalizes.
On one hand, our minds are affected Chinese character. As is known to us, Chinese character is image-expressed and the Chinese grammar is lose and non-logical. According to this, we learn the meaning between lines and when this applies to the social level, people seek to read one’s mind by his faces. On the other hand, Chinese are instilled by the Confucius culture which means it is unfair to take a western criterion which in essence relates to a critical mind to judge the Chinese. One of the Confucius thought is that one should think of others when we behave.To communicate implicitly is thought to be kind to others and on the contrary to speak directly may easily get someone hurt.
Of course, the society of China does exist somehow imperfection. And this imperfection usually makes foreigners uncomfortable. However, we are trying to make more effective communication with the world outside China which means we are making changes and also persist what is treasure in our own culture.
In fact face inhibits personal growth and development. I agree with it. I have the same experiment .When I do some things that I can do but I should take risks, I will waste much
time of deciding to do or not. I am worried with face problem .I’m shy to show myself. So I
must change this mind and dare to do what I can do, don’t miss the good chance.
It was truly a study result, but I just want to say a study shows that face is also evident in a Chinese business negotiation context and in the study, it tells us that many observers find that the Chinese prefer to do business with large companies with world reputations to gain face; Even in business negotiations, we can use the face to explain the Chinese negotiation style – for example, meeting in a group, proceeding cautiously and slowly – from the face perspective.
BUT the famous American company, in which I worked as a vendor manager before, also prefers to do business with large companies, and that can be seen from their vendor evaluation criteria such as total sales, total stuff and so on. What’s more, I worked with vendors from some other Asia countries, take Japan as an example. They would like to do everything cautiously and slowly.
So I think FACE is not only part of Chinese culture but also part of culture of human being.
wow, face in china can be a big topic. We have to agree with the auther’s opinion in a certain degree, because it does play a negtive role in some areas of our daily life. But as a Chinese, we all clearly know that face is also very good and very important. That’s why few students totally agree with the auther. Actually,it’s the mirrior of our culture or it’s our culture itself. And it’s our way to deal the interpersonal relationships, just like playing Taichi, avoiding the direct conflicts. If a foreigner really wants to know Chinese, he must not only know its importance to Chinese and know how to use Fce.
When I was a child, I was always taught by lots of people about that:” You should be well-behaved. You should obey the words your parents and teachers told you. You should do everything the others do, not do anything the others not do. Or you will lose your parents’ face and yours.” With time going on, I am used to keep lost in the crowd, act like the majority persons, not to excel or stand out, for the reason that I am worried about losing my face. It’s indeed a crucial factor that prevents me to grow to be more excellent.
To be specific, FACE will stop me elevating my English level. I will dare not to talk worrying about false and losing my face. If I really want to develop my English, I should forget FACE first of all.
Every coin have two sides.Face in China is very important in many fields,at the same time noticing our faces is our nation ttadition.In my opion ,the idea of professor has some scientific reason.Because we don not pay attention to our face in some occassion ,for example,we practice our speaking English at the beganning.SO,when we treat Face ,we must distinguish different occasion.
I do not agree with the author. “So-so” has a meaning of mean thinking in traditional Chinese culture, which dates back to Confucianism. It is the essence of traditional Chinese culture and the spiritual pillar of the people. With the development of society, it is normal for the “so-so” attitude to presents some drawbacks. The key is to find problems, solve problems, constantly adjust thoughts and advance with the times.
Obviously, So-So is No-No. People should try their best to pursuit excellence. Even in China, we are educated to be a good student again and again. The FACE may be a main motivation to pursuit excellence. Just like the western people consider freedom and creativity is important.
It is a certain fact that the service in China is poor. But it doesn’t necessary to conclude that Chinese people do not have complaints just because of the consideration of FACE. The truth is Chinese people usually express their judgments in the private communication. They don’t blame the weakness of the service openly just for the requirement of polite. People don’t want to break the peaceful relationship with others, but they will try to show their critical opinion in another way.
However, the article says something right about the problem of EXCESS FACE. If people think about the risk of making mistake and losing FACE too much, their practice will be confined. The terrible consequence is that they will not have enough confidence and courage to show their weakness. It is really a meaningful problem to the Chinese teachers and the whole Chinese society.
In a word, the EXCESS FACE is harmful and it may cause us to make dangerous irrational decisions. Therefore, I agree with the essay that we should learn more to the western people, So-So is No-No.
An old Chinese saying goes: “A man has face, a tree has bark.” Face – honour and prestige
- is a visceral issue in China. Without it one is undeserving of respect.The thought of
keeping up appearances in public occasions makes our Chinese form a habit of being
scrupulousness and never easily demonstrating.
We can often see that in a relatively situation,only a few guys will bahave positively while most people keep silent.It seems that once you open your mouth,your ignorance and
weakness will be exposed quickly before everyone.Then your face is lost and you may be laughed at.So,we are all willing to keep silence in the crowd.
We should acknowledge that it sometimes holds us back.For example, you are supposed to show a unusual but wonderful thinking——maybe it is helpful for the resolvation of the
problem,but owing to fearing to lose face,you give up the idea of saying it out.Finally,nobody know about it.What a pity!
Maybe it is time for us to change our minds now.Just say what you think out.Only you say it out,can you find what improvement you need.And only you become more perfect,can you keep your face.
“Face” is very important to a Chinese people. “We can’t lose our face.” When we do something, especially face to others, we have such ideal. The most important thing is, we can’t face to the failure, we don’t have the courage to admit our failure. Failure is the mother of success, So-So will never to be success. We should change our attitude , and say “bye-bye” to “so-so”.
“So-so” phenomenon is popular in Chinese society. I think “middle way” should account for this. The ancestors taught us to be unassuming, so the people would not show his outstanding aspect. But now, with the step of internationalization, this custom seems useless and needs to be changed. As we know, in American and West Europe, people like to show their personalities. Instead of showing out, people in China like to hide their excellent talent. However, we should change our minds on the custom because it does harm our society. People prefer so-so and don’t want to improve their products, raise their service level and so on. This does make a barrier for the development of our country. We need to change it as quickly as possible!
China is a tranditional country and Chinese believe a middle course is the safest. As the old saying goes: “Laws are not laid down to punish the majority” “A point man is always exposed to attack”.So we are silent when we face some problems. When I was a undergraduate,my classmates and I used to recite reference answers before the examination,and we had almost the same answers in the examination. We are afraid of breaking the rules, We are worried about standing out in a crowd. We would not make big mistake in that way,but we also would not achieve a huge success if we act like that.
“Face” has become a unique culture in china. That’s not good for the development of the whole society. Social progress needs innovation and innovation originates from creative thinking. If our thoughts are imprisoned,how can we fly our own colors. We ought to learn to don’t care others’ peculiar look and we will have a more colorful life.
Face is really important for Chinese people. It is true that sometimes the fear of losing face prevents China from developing and impoving. I agree that there are many negative infuences of faces. However, the existance is truth! Faces have been companying Chinese people ever since long long ago. Chinese are working hard in order not to lose face, or in order to earn face, and this is sure helpful to make life better and better.
“Face” is the Chinese people’s core value. They pay attention to the problem of “Face”. To the Chinese people, “Face” is the symbol of status, identity, honor and so on. But it also represents the vanity. So I agree with the author. “Face” would retard our development. In our study, if we focus on “Face” too much, we would refuse to think and do differently. Although China’s educational system does exist some problems. But in my opinion, “collective face” mentality comes from the Confucianism, rather than China’s educational system. Nowadays, our country’s educational system advocates the innovation. From now on, if we want to learn English well, we should forget “Face” first of all. We must speak English confidently in public.
think English is one of important skills we need to predominate in our future life,so I always want to improve my oral English and am desire to communicate with someone .Also,do not want to be a silence English student when I have study English for ten years .I hope that I can acquire a good achievement in spoken English this semester with the help of professor.
“Face” is indeed a problem in China. The view in the article is valid. The face culture really influenced all of us Chinese, no matter what wo are doing or where we are ,we always protect our “Face”. Maybe “Face” will affect the development of our country too. Just as the author say, “Face” had affected our English teaching for many students choose to silent English rather to even say an English word. This is severe. But as we all known, to change the situatiom is not so easy since our Chinese culture is marked by the culture of propriety and rig hteousness system during a long history of many centuries. So it is hard for us to throw away our “Face” in a mintue. Of course, we shoule face up to our negative aspects and try our best to improve it gradully.
When I saw the sentence”Every student is required to memorize the exact same answer to each and every question. No one is allowed to think or act differently.”,it just reminds me of a story,a sad story,it narrate that a teacher asked a pupil “What the curving moon like”,the standard answer was a little boat,but the pupil just answered bean sprout.The teacher punished the pupil because she made a wrong answer,and the pupil was so hard done by why the moon couldn’t look like a bean.In this story,you can find that,why the Chinese rather be lost in a crowd than recognized for excellence,not only because of “face”,but also rooting from our elementary education,which cuts the throat of our creativity and made us a normal person,who enjoyed being lost in a crowd.As the going says,”The nail that sticks up mostly gets hammered down”,it was safe to be lost in a crowd.To sovle that,some encouragements rather than punishment for the excel people are neended!
I smiled when I Looking at the tittle, however, I became seirous at the body of the artical. “Forget your face” or “face is nothing” I think this is the most popular sentences we heard when we have a oral English course, some foreign teachers may can not understand that why Chinese students take so much importance to their face and afraid to open their mouths. It is difficult to explain clearly, if you grow up in China, you will recognize that the face to a person like the bark to a tree. It is so important that we will consider whether it will lose our face when we do everythings. It is difficult to get rid of.
Of course, I agree that the problems of “FACE” restrict our chinese students’ individual character growth, is not good for us, we should change our “so-so” attitude. as these years, I think our country is developed very well, become more open. One day “so-so” will not be the describe of China any more.
Nowadays in China, poor service or poor product can be seen everywhere. Sometimes the waiters will force you to checkout when you are still having your dinner, just because it is time to go off work. But service in some places of China is better, like Hong Kong and Guangzhou. The service industry is more prosperous here. Poor product is not welcomed by consumers, fake product is even disgusting! Some consumers have complained to the related department. They are willing to lose face and stand out, but the problem still can’t be solved effectively. As time goes by, we are used to staying silent. We all know that the producers can do everything in order to decrease the cost. Sometimes we really don’t know how to deal with them.
It is true that the “collective face” retards China’s development. Almost everyone is afraid of being laughed at. Students are shamed to consult teachers and they prefer to memorize the standard answers. We are good at exercise and exams but we don’t do well in creativity and problem-solving. “Collective face” will still exist in China for a long time, because there is complicate social factor in it. But we can do more to improve it. I really believed that with the development of economy, law and ourselves, things will be better in the future.
I should agree with that face is very important in China.Face is a conventional culture in China.We do many things because of face.For example,we always like to pay foy others when having lunch together,I rarely speak English because I’m afraid of loosing my face,I think others would laugh at me if I make mistakes…..I think so,many others think so.So we shut up and refuse to practice it.Even if I want to improve my speaking English,I would not like to change.I think this atitude is not proper now.
I don’t agree with the view of this passage. Being afraid of losing face obliges me to work harder, or I will get a lower grade which can make lose face. Maybe you think it prevents my active participation in the class presentation. Yes,it is! But I think it is not the only reason, even not the main reason. I think the main reason is that none cares their feeling ever since.
As to why there are so many poor products and poor services, I think the reason is the wrong system of the enterprise. Many firms are owned to the government, and they have no motivity to work harder because of the monopolization.
Most of phenomenon mentioned in the article does exist in China, and really raises some issues, but the interpretation of phenomena is controversial. When we talk about the “Face saying”, it is not just a simple habit or just false pride that Chinese people stick to; it is the special ethos cultural which is bound up with China’s complex and long-long history. Face saying is a double-edged sword. On the one hand it makes us feel confined and cockamamie, on the other hand it leads us to respect others and point out the problem in good faith, and the most important is it presses us to us feel ashamed for misdoings and then regulates our own behavior.
I am not agreed that Chinese people brush aside the existence of substandard products. When I am unsatisfied with the service I will point it out and ask for some improve or corresponding compensation as most Chinese people do. Throw Face away in classes, beyond doubt, is much useful for our study，and our teachers drum in the concept of “be courageous and speak out” early in our primary school.
From my point of view, when we speak of the fear of making mistakes in class, it may means that we should hold ordinary mind and more tolerance, another thing that has nothing to do with the so-called Face.
In China, we have to admit that face problem happens from time to time. However, if we want to achieve success, we had better overcome the love of face. If we love face, we will become the victims.
As for Chinese students, we should cherish the opportunity to improve our English, and it is of great help to tell ourselves that we are not afraid of losing face. As Emerson says,” No one can cheat you out of ultimate success but yourselves.” Therefore, there is no need for us to worry about standing out in a crowd, just go on with it!
Well I love this topic.I can talk a lot about it because is not only about FACE,it has deeper reason,related to our history,culture,politics and so on.First I should say,different countries have different cultures.You shouldn’t say this culture is better than that one,or more advanced. The world exist because of the diversity of cultures.I was a journalist before I know what is not allowed to post on because of our FACE.I watch CNN by net because I want to know how what we look like in others’ eyes. Some people like to argue about the facticity about news, I think it’s insignificant because what happen is true only because you see it from different angles,that is base on different history,cultures.
However,I hate the collective FACE.So allow me to say,I do love the classroom where we have oral English.There,I can smell freedom.Pursuing freedom is one kind of human nature,isn’t it? I love active atmosphere where we can talk,act freely,no need to think about FACE.You can laugh at others,or others laugh at you. It doesn’t matter because laughing is also human nature.We entertain others, and get entertained,this is life.So I don’t like the way of teaching in China I should say,which will kill your creativity because collective FACE.Classroom is a place where we learn.We come here because we want to get knowledge.The goal is what we know and how we can use it,as the rules–you can’t go to washroom or you can’t talk while having a class,who cares? I am just that kind of people when I have my opinion about what the teach taught I will speak out immediately.Luckily it was encouraged in my Alma Mater.
Collective FACE is harmful.I have read 1984 written by Orwell.A society without diversity and freedom leaves you the feeling of death.
However,I believe Chinese regard FACE so important is base on our history.We all know China has very,very long history.Dated long long ago,to survive people fight with the nature world every day,every moment.It calls for cooperation,to fight together.People must help each other,tolerate others for the same goal,to live on.It gradually form the tradition of collective FACE.However nowadays people have more personal ideas bacause the globalization provides more chances to contact with the outside world.
It seems I’m not satisfied with my country.In fact,it’s because I love it so deeply I want her to be better.Some saying is not allowed in public but for a better China,I will.It seems like I don’t have FACE,isn’t it?It doesn’t matter.Just laugh at me,I will tougher.
So-so is no-no. It’s right in the classroom, but I don’t think it’s “so-so” that results in the poor products and service in our country. What is “so-so”? Which I think it’s some attitude-thing. The so-called “so-so”, to some extent, means that you are mean to not get things better. I just can’t agree on it. There are many reasons of that poor stuff (Frankly, some products and service are poor, but not all). In addition, Face, deeply rooted in China, is one kind of culture, not only Chinese, but also the Eastern. We Chinese are deeply impacted by Confucianism, of which the point is “ceremony”, teaching us to act politely without embarrassing others or ourselves. Maybe that’s why we take Face so seriously, not “the consequence of the socialist society”. Of course, we really need some change in some aspects. That’s my point.
as for the poor service, it is not that nobody cares, but more like that civilians don’t know how to improve it. people complain about it, and eager for its being better. the only problem of the mass is that we try so hard to bear it. but we should see that the so-so-bearing is now “better”, we have changed a lot, Chinese people now realise that they should ask for proper right and enjoy a much better service which they deserve.
back to behaviour in class, it is not just about face, the case is more complicated. for some, they don’t care about other’s judgement on their English, and they even always tell people that their English is bad. so waht’s the problem, it concerns to their personality. well, if a person just don’t like to be active but pay attention to what is require by the professor and spare no effort in studying and learning, can you blame him? of course not.
the encouragement made by professor Martin in Class is not suit for everyone(though I believe some of the student does buy it much), and the story he told is a typical “American dream”–a poor boy built his career from the lowest point and got a great success. The classroom seems to me is more like an utopian island, I go in and have a dream last for 1.5-2 hours, then I go out, and go back to my normal life. the life that Martin showed us is great, but not what I am looking for. after all, life is complicated, much complicated than the “utopian life” I have on the class.
Still, I appreciate professor Wolff’s passion in English Teaching.
The passage above states it is the fear of losing face that slows the development in our country. I don’t agree. In contrast, I think it is just the emphasis of face pushing our country forward. Our economy is growing rapidly these days, which results from our endless desire and efforts to gain an international acknowledged reputation and status. I admit that some low quality products and imperfect services do come out as the side effect of the overheated economy. However, it’s not the fault of our sense of FACE, instead it is because we lack of an effective mechanism to deal with the complaints against the inferior goods and services. If we can expose the complaints to the public, the related company should improve it in order to regain its FACE, or else they will be washed out by the market thanks to their ill fame.
Also, I admit that nowadays the meaning of FACE is somewhat misleading. The essence of FACE in Chinese lies in self respect. Making mistake is nothing to do with your face. Today, there is a very famous saying on internet, “People with no fear of mistake are more respected than those never make mistake.” It’s very inspiring. We should work hard to win a ‘big FACE’, rather than keep the FACE that you may not have yet. Since “so-so” is “no-no”.
This article is really thought-provoking. But in my opinion, things are much more complicated in China. FACE is not the only reason for problems that mentioned in the article.
Poor services and products are facts that exist widely in China, I can’t agree more. Every time when I go to a bank or a hospital, I have to wait for a long time and the clerk’s attitude is always bad. But I’m sure the reason for poor services and products in China is complicated. Regimes are still waiting to be improved, after all, China is a developing country. I’m sure things will be much better in the future.
As for the Chinese education system, there are many problems and people have already concerned about. Requiring students to memorizing answers maybe is not a best teaching way but is a good way to instill knowledge into students’ mind. However, it also brings big problems. Students always assume that there is a standard answer and are afraid of having different thoughts.
Indeed, every Chinese love FACE, as a Chinese, I can tell. It’s one of the Chinese traditional cultures. In our daily life, we always care about FACE, giving others FACE, keeping our own FACE. We are so concerned about FACE that we always think twice before we act. That’s the problem. Because of FACE, we choose tolerance instead of complaints when we encounter poor services; because of FACE, we dare not think and act differently from others; because of FACE, we don’t want to open our mouth and speak English, being afraid of making mistakes and losing FACE.
We can’t change things immediately, but I’m going to change myself gradually. I know that if I want my oral English improved, I have to forget FACE. I’m going to do that from now on.
To make someone lose face (even unknowingly) is a huge dishonor and could mean the end of a relationship.This is usually avoided by the telling of what are called ‘white lies” in the west ,that is to say something which isn’t completely true to save the other person face .Business disputes are also often handled informally by a third party outside the legal system to avoid loss of face.
No matter where, just anywhere, the poeple don’t like being criticized appreciate it. People would not admit their mistakes because they don’t want to lose face (this is not the same as the chinese ‘lose face’).
However, it is inconceivable that those Chinese love face actually lose face everywhere, and some even lose face in foreign country. Mainland tourists in Hong Kong run the red light, spiting anywhere, even sneak through without a ticket on a self-service bus . Surprisingly, those who do these things are not feel ashamed as such losing face.. So Chinese face is not so sacred ,sometimes it’s no more than a virtual ring.
In my opinion,it is wrong to criticize the “Collective Face” simply.On one side,everything has two sides-positive and negative,we couldn’t discard it just for its disadvantages.we should treat it objectively.On the othe hand,the original sourse of this concept is chinese culture. From the childhood we receive this kind of education,and form such thought.One day we find the disadvantages of the thought, then we deny it entirely.How foolish it is.
I really agree with the author on the face issue. Sometimes I truly hate the face issue, which inhibits me from doing many things more actively and doing things in my own way. And sometimes I am eager to get rid of all the thoughts of face issue, to be brave, active and decisive. However, the face issue is not so easy to abandon. It’s a culture, a group consciousness and a value accepted by almost all the Chinese. It’s rooted in our head by all the surroundings since we are born. So what could I do to get rid of it?
“Face” is one of our country’s conventions.It is a fact that there are many problems existing in our socialty just because of “our face”.But,as the coin has two sides.”Face” sometimes stand for persistence and resolute.Many people try their best to succeed just because they do not want to lose face and they do not like to fail, maintaining the face is their motive power.So,we should dispose the negative sides and make good use of the positive sides.”Face” should not slow the development of china.
Every coin has two sides.FACE is not a simple problem for Chinese people.Truly,our Chinese people always have strong sense about one’s face.If a person wants to keep his face,he usually need to be very careful when make a decision,and try his best to avoid making mistakes,he may be not willing to try anything new,that is why many western people think Chinese are a little too conservative.But also,if a person wants to win his face,he will work very hard to make success.In this sense of way,face become a driving force for a person.Also, I want to say,I really have the idea that the Chinese youth are trying their best to reject the negative side of the traditional meaning of face.They no longer think “So-So”is OK,they have strong sense to make theirselves outstanding and excellent.They are trying,and I think they have made great progress.
I strongly agree with Professor Martin that FACE sometimes inhibits personal growth and development, especially in English classes. However, I don’t think FACE leads to “So-So” necessarily and the “collective face” retards China’s development. Instead, “collective face” can create excellence and accelerate China’s development sometimes. Just because “collective face”, we make every effort to do things better. Take the 2008 Olympic Games for example, we held a perfect opening ceremony in Beijing and the success of the Olympic Games is multi-faceted, no wonder that President Jacques Rogge praised “These were truly exceptional games”. Without “collective face”, I cannot imagine how Chinese people achieve these successes.
Recently,as the expand of cultural exchange and flow of trained personnel,the issue about the ills of our education have been pay more and more attention. Many academician begin to promote personality and propose to reform our education system from producing academician “products”. But as many people above pointed out,Rome was not Built in one day.We have made great progress,at thesame time,we still have a long way to go.
Each nation will has its own culture,just as the American spirit of innovation,the strict attitude of the Germans.Maybe “Face” is part of China culture.I think so because it can reflect from the other side,not the negative effect,but the positive. Recall the story you told us in the first class,I can say the stutent who lose his face in your class was really take care about his face. He lose his face,so he wanted to retake it.Then he had the excitation to try his best in your class. For “Face”,we will think more before move,we will try to do the best.But in most cases, “Face” has the negative effect as the essay refered, so, the most important thing is loving face in the right cases.
It is undeniable that the Chinese people attach great importance to “Face”, because “Face” is on behalf of theirs status and dignity.However, too much emphasis on face will also have many negative effects.China is a developing country, “collective face” will hinder its development.For the students,take into account theirs face will be too afraid to express themselves, they always dare not participate in activities becase of fearing make mistakes , then, they lose the opportunity for self-improvement.Those shows that if we put down “collective face”,we will be more likely to succeed.
“Face” is really very important to Chinese people, we do everything to defend our face. Maybe it looks strange and incomprehensible for people from other country. it is a traditinal phenomenion based on the Chinese history and culture. I really think it is a big barrier to provent China from development. I myself love and defend my “face” too. One of my teacher told me that students from China are the shiest in a class of MIT. I think all the education we have received in more than ren years has told ue to receive things without asking questions, which is the main reason why we are so quiet and shy in class. However, I think these situations will be better in the future. China is developing fast and it is indispensable for her to meet some problems or falure, but I do believe she will slive these problems, actually I think she has realized some of the problems and tring to solve them.
As the author say, so long as FACE is a prized possession, China will remain a developing country. Chinese always think that people should not be too emulative, or trouble will come. Keep mediocrity is an intelligent way to live in the world, which can be found in many Chinese traditional classical works. But in modern society, competition is becoming more and more intense within countries，zones，companies and so forth. So this Chinese traditional thought may be old-fashioned. You are right; “SO-SO” is “NO-NO”.
And we should say “NO-NO” to “SO-SO”.
It is really interesting to read the article ‘The dynamics of Chinese face mechanisms and classroom behavior: a case study’, because I see myself everywhere. When the author pointed out the four types of face-related factors (low-risk face, collective face, hierarchical face and harmonious face), I just can’t help thinking I have been in such situation before too. And what happened to the three volunteer participants are familiar to me. But I never take a close look at the phenomenon and try to analyze how it keep me away from speaking English until now.
We are Chinese people. Maybe we don’t like to take high risks but fit into a hierarchy. We pursue harmony in the collectivist society. We sharing the common characteristics, which are affected by a culture of 5000 years. We are acting like that just because we are who we are.
However, when it comes to acquiring a language, one thing is supposed to receive top priority. That is, we are not simply learning how to use a foreign language, actually we are also learning about the entirely different culture behind it. How about integrating into the English culture when we speak English. We can try to think in an English mindset, forget the FACE thing while we are talking in English. Perhaps this will help us to have the courage to speak out our thoughts in English and be more straight forward day after day.
The main idea of this article is very good, and describes some of the aspects of the china society in a vivid way. However, I do not agree with it in some aspect.
According to the article, Chinese goods and products are substandard and even defective. Yes, this may be the fact a few years ago, when domestically produced goods are totally rubbish compared with their foreign counterparts. But now, things have changed a lot. We have many national brand names today, such as Haier, Lenovo, TCL etc. The quality of the products made by these companies has helped them to gain worldwide reputations, and bring about considerable profits. So in this case, excellence is recognized.
Definitely,”Face” is a huge barrier for our country to make progress.We care about the comments given by others. That’s why our government just emphasize the figure of GDP,but not the resident’s standard of living. Large part of Chinese people live without security is the truth rather than the high GDP. Resident get nearly nothing benifit from the number.For the education, the similar problem exist.For instance, we concern how many paper we have issue but not the quality of the paper.
But Face problem is just one of the reason lead to insufficient creativity of Chinese students.
Chinese exam-oriented education make lots of Chinese students lost their creativity. Because under this kind of education system, students’ taget is to get a high grade in the exam. All the criteria to assess a student is how many scores he get. So, you can image that if he encounter a difficult issue, he just need to guarantee what he write down on the test paper is right,even need not to know how can he get it. It’s almost impossible to find an alternative method to solve a same problem. And if you have a answer book,what you do is keeping in mind.